InnoHosting and EZPZHosting both offer UK servers but none are VAT registered?

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Posted by hiheyhello, 09-12-2010, 07:00 PM
Howcomes both InnoHosting and EZPZHosting offer UK servers, they seem to be located in the UK but none have a UK VAT number? InnoHosting is a registered UK company but it does not offer GBP currency? Then again EZPZHosting is not a registered UK company and it does offer GBP currency. What the hell? Anyone care to explain? I like both companies but how do I deal with tax if one has USD currency and the other one ain't even registered?
Posted by trustedurl.com, 09-12-2010, 07:08 PM
Why not ask EZPZHosting where they are registered? Re. the billing, it depends on where their merchant account is or if they use a 3rd party (e.g. 2checkout, paypal); probably ask them if they can bill you in GBP as that seems to be what you're looking for.
Posted by Dustin B Cisneros, 09-12-2010, 07:21 PM
Exactly, You will need to contact their billing departments...
Posted by hiheyhello, 09-12-2010, 07:29 PM
Can I contact them here within the forum?
Posted by techjr, 09-12-2010, 07:33 PM
It would be best to contact them directly for the fastest response. There are a large amount of hosts that do not constantly check there WHT and the ones that do may not even know the information asked. It is best to contact sales/billing
Posted by thishosting, 09-12-2010, 08:03 PM
They don't have to be VAT registered to operate. It depends entirely on their turnover. The threshold in the UK is around £55,000 to be registered for VAT, but I believe it isn't an obligation to register.
Posted by hiheyhello, 09-12-2010, 08:19 PM
It's actually £70K and yes they are obligated to do so if they make such a turnover. I guess if none of these companies are VAT registered it means that their turnover is quite little hence I would probably be better of with a company such as UnitedHosting? It's just that I need a long term and quality company to work with, I don't want the company going down in a year or two.
Posted by hiheyhello, 09-12-2010, 08:23 PM
Dude, is spechosting.com your company? If it is I would recommend you fix that spelling mistake on the homepage. xD "London Englend"
Posted by rv_irl, 09-12-2010, 08:36 PM
A small correction, that's turnover from EU companies which VAT needs to be applied to, VAT does not need to be charged on companies outside the EU. As such if the company is or is not VAT registered it doesn't provide any indication of whether or not they are a large or small company
Posted by hiheyhello, 09-12-2010, 08:45 PM
Thank you for your reply. So if the company charges me in USD for a UK server, how do I deal with tax for end of year return? Do I convert the USD to GBP?
Posted by thishosting, 09-12-2010, 08:49 PM
Just because their turnover isn't at that level, is absolutely no indication of how good the company is. I mean in all fairness look at GoDaddy. Huge turnover, but bad service. Anyway, best of luck with your search.
Posted by rv_irl, 09-12-2010, 08:59 PM
Since you're mentioning GBP, I'm assuming you're UK based. As such if a company charges you in USD, come tax time you need to convert the USD transactions into GBP. The HMRC publishes the exchange rates you should use.
Posted by MikeTrike, 09-12-2010, 09:07 PM
Alternatively you could hire a Tax/Accounting specialist to deal with all of this for you.
Posted by UH-Matt, 09-13-2010, 04:09 AM
No, but a company with a larger turnover is likely to have some power behind it. When the sh*t hits the fan a company turning over less than £70k a year is likely to struggle compared to a company turning over 20-30-40 times that amount.
Posted by HostXNow_Chris, 09-13-2010, 05:44 AM
Going on like they're a fly-by-night host or something. Both EZPZHosting and InnoHosting have a good rep. I don't think they'll be going anywhere anytime soon.
Posted by target, 09-13-2010, 05:55 AM
I guess u are living in the UK ? Isn't there a tax-agency or a financial department from your gouverment where u can ask this kind of questions ? Than u are sure the answer is correct, here u will only find some guesses.
Posted by Cats-Computing, 09-13-2010, 07:58 AM
I recall Rameen once making a post that indicated their annual turnover was in the region of six digits, but I could be wrong. Not that annual turnover makes or breaks a company
Posted by Yujin, 09-13-2010, 01:03 PM
Wow, its nice to know that you need to be on a particular limit before you have VAT registered in UK. Is that correct?
Posted by UH-Matt, 09-13-2010, 01:27 PM
Yep if you are a small business trading less than £70,000 in a year then you do not need to be VAT registered.
Posted by Yujin, 09-13-2010, 01:40 PM
Thanks for the reply Matt. If you don't mind me asking...If the company in UK is not reaching the limit yearly does it mean that your local client pay as it is and you don't add any VAT percentage for all purchases? If that is the case does it mean that you don't have to pay anything in the government?
Posted by UH-Matt, 09-13-2010, 01:41 PM
If you are not VAT registered then you do not charge VAT to your clients, or deliver VAT tax to the government at all.
Posted by Yujin, 09-13-2010, 01:51 PM
Thanks for that info. I guess this is something that I will be considering in the future for choosing my provider in the UK.
Posted by UH-Matt, 09-13-2010, 01:53 PM
You would actively look for non-VAT registered hosting? seems odd to me that you would want to do that necessarily. Also VAT is only charged by UK companies to people in the EU. If you are outside of the EU then you should not be charged VAT tax by any company, even if you are buying from a VAT registered UK business
Posted by Yujin, 09-13-2010, 01:58 PM
I understand and like you had previously stated
Posted by Scott.Mc, 09-13-2010, 03:07 PM
It's ~£70k to EU only. We for example, while being a UK business and way above the threshold, are not required to register for VAT because the overwhelming majority of business is outside the EU. Lucky if there is more than ~20 from the EU. I assume it's a similar case for IH.
Posted by lentak, 10-30-2010, 04:46 PM
Well, there was some changes in Policy since 1.1.2010. All EU companies that are selling services or goods to other EU company (from different country as supplier is) are required to be registered for VAT. E.g. if Innohosting sells services to UK companies only, they don't have to be registered for VAT until they meet 70k GBP turnover. But if they want to sell services to companies in other EU countries they are required to be VAT registered. Therefore Innohosting should be VAT registered. However they can decide what currecy they use on invoices.
Posted by 040Hosting, 10-30-2010, 05:18 PM
Would love a link to that one, if you have one please share.
Posted by lentak, 10-30-2010, 06:13 PM
http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/vat/cross-bor...anges-2010.htm VAT: Cross-border VAT changes 2010 Who will be affected by the changes? Businesses supplying services to overseas businesses. Businesses receiving services from overseas businesses. Businesses supplying goods to other EC countries. Businesses that want to reclaim VAT incurred in another EC country.
Posted by target, 10-31-2010, 04:30 AM
And what if they don't ? Because they do sell it to companies in other EU countries.
Posted by 040Hosting, 10-31-2010, 07:44 AM
I am well aware of these rules, as they are obviously the same in other European countries, but in the article they are only talking about VAT registered companies, what i was wondering about is how would this be for companies which apparently do not need to file VAT under a particular amount. I can certainly understand businesses to question if a company is vat registered or not, personally i wouldn't do business with a non vat-registered company in europe. And honestly i am amazed if it would be true these companies are not vat-registered, for the OP, i would certainly contact them personally and ask them first. Last edited by 040Hosting; 10-31-2010 at 07:45 AM. Reason: clarified.
Posted by lentak, 10-31-2010, 09:29 AM
I don't know...they should be registered, or call HMRC and ask if they need to be registered.
Posted by MikeDVB, 10-31-2010, 02:17 PM
I'd contact them directly and ask if they're VAT registered, not sure that you'll get a direct answer here on WHT.
Posted by ldcdc, 11-01-2010, 10:25 AM
About EZPZ, the answer was that they're not VAT registered. I'm not an accountant nor a lawyer, so I can't comment on the situation, though I was a bit surprised. I would imagine that both EZPZ, and more so Innohosting, have a yearly revenue higher than the mentioned 70K. Last edited by ldcdc; 11-01-2010 at 10:30 AM.
Posted by lentak, 11-01-2010, 10:56 AM
Ok, so I have studied again little bit and it seems that they do not need to be VAT registered if they provide online services to other EU businesses. In such case VAT is paid by the customer in his/her country of business. But they need to register when they provide services to countries outside of EU, in such a case they need to pay VAT in UK. However I'm not an accountant. This VAT regulations from 1/1/2010 are really stupid. Hopefully they will get it back as it was before...
Posted by 040Hosting, 11-01-2010, 02:10 PM
That is completely incorrect; companies or even individuals outside of europe never pay tax; companies outside of the european member state you are in have the option to provide you with their valid VATid; if that one is checked (i.e. here http://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs...tedLanguage=EN ) you can waive the VAT. In someone buys services or goods : Companies within your own country: always pay tax Companies outside of your own country but in Europe with a valid vatid: dont pay tax Individuals and or companies outside of europe: dont pay tax everyone else does pay tax. There might small difference as maybe not all countries did implement the tax rules correctly yet; but they where supposed to implement these as per 1-1-2010. So even if these two companies are not registered; then somewhere they dont fill in their intracommunity VAT liability; and probably will be charged later for it. Hope they are aware of that. Find it even more interesting that they keep very quiet in these forums about it
Posted by nuthin, 11-01-2010, 09:47 PM
If it's a similar setup to the Australian GST (Goods Services Tax) for example I'm not registered as most of my income is derived from outside of Austrralia and paid to me. If I did most of my business with other Australian businesses and met the thresh-hold which is $70k too I believe, I would then need to be registered for GST. I just don't include GST on my invoices and it's up to the other company if they still want to deal with me. It really does depend and I'm sure both companies would always pay their tax obligations. So I wouldn't pick up a company based on things like this. Look at there reps, they both seem to be solid. Just my 2cents. Last edited by nuthin; 11-01-2010 at 09:51 PM.
Posted by lentak, 11-02-2010, 06:59 AM
You are wrong... You are selling online services, therefore the country of delivery is the country where customer is from, therefore VAT needs to be paid in his country. There are several cases here: Let's say I have a company in any of EU country that is not registered for VAT 1.) I sell services to businesses and customers in the same state without any problems. No VAT needed. 2.) I sell services to other customers (not businesses) in any of EU state. No VAT needed. 3.) I sell services to businesses in different EU country. The customer business needs to be registered for VAT and he needs to pay this VAT at his country. This is a must, otherwise he cannot buy a service from me.
Posted by 040Hosting, 11-02-2010, 07:24 AM
I would strongly advise you to contact your accountant. While rules may still be different in several EU countries; the laws of providing SERVICES have been changed since 1-1-2010 so 1 and 2 are wrong; well at least here in the Netherlands; as we ALWAYS have to be vat registered; just not need to pay vat below a particular amount, we still have to proof it. Maybe the difference with you is in the fact that you dont have to charge local vat under a particular amount of business; but from where we stand that is not really called a business but a hobby.
Posted by lentak, 11-02-2010, 07:34 AM
Yes, you're right, first two points are not for you, as NL company needs to be always registered for VAT (I think this is just the only country where this is necessary), so you charge VAT on all of your invoices. But I suppose that the 3rd point is also valid for you, so you cannot sell any service to EU company that is not registered for VAT.
Posted by 040Hosting, 11-02-2010, 08:18 AM
Yes you can still sell to a company that is not registered for VAT; but you will need to charge them VAT, as they are then not seen as a company.
Posted by lentak, 11-02-2010, 09:13 AM
This makes sense. and this also should be the final answer However I hate those regulations...is it better to open a business in Seychelles. No VAT, no accountants, no problems...
Posted by MikeDVB, 11-02-2010, 03:05 PM
Accountants are almost always a good idea unless your revenues are extremely small. We've gone without accountants for almost three years now but we're going to be bringing at least one on board to make sure that things are kept straight such as taxes and other financial obligations. Once you get so large, it becomes difficult to keep track of it all without a little help from somebody who is specialized in that sort of thing.
Posted by lentak, 11-05-2010, 07:20 AM
There is a VAT training in London: http://www.uktrainingworldwide.com/t...efund.asp?id=2
Posted by mdrussell, 11-05-2010, 06:36 PM
Then they are breaking the law if their turnover is higher and the fines will be hefty. If you are VAT registered and you trade online, it is "advised" that you display your VAT number for all to see. Technically they can be a UK incorporated company with under £70k worth of revenue in the EU but have non-EU revenue of more than £70k GBP which would make their turnover higher... Like it was mentioned here, I'm not sure why anyone would go for a non-VAT registered company. VAT registration suggests you are of a particular size and are smart enough to manage your accounts / employ a good accountant. Given the number of fly-by-night hosting companies, this can be a good yet easy indication of the stature of the company you are dealing with.
Posted by mdrussell, 11-05-2010, 06:38 PM
040Hosting is correct. Anyone outside of NL but in the EU is charged VAT (in his case) unless they supply a valid VAT number. Then when he does his VAT return, the EU's wonderful and tax payer funded VAT system automatically scans through it.
Posted by lentak, 11-05-2010, 06:57 PM
I don't think that VAT number shows how big is the company, or how healthy is the company, or how smart is management. I think it is just one more problem in doing the business. I would suggest to stop all the VAT system and allow to run businesses without this. I think that in EU there is quite big mass of companies that doesn't know how new VAT regulations work. I lost one customer from different EU country as he would need to register for VAT, if he would want to renew his services with me... So it was better for him to find such service in his country. I am not VAT registered LTD in UK and he is not VAT registered sole-trader in CZ. So tell me, does he need to register for VAT if he is buying the online service from me?
Posted by mdrussell, 11-05-2010, 07:06 PM
Let's drop all VAT? I don't think this will speed up the deficit recovery faced by most European nations.

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